But I see no reason to believe that Jesus of Nazareth has been, is, or will be the means of grace or hope of glory. I am married and trust my wife but like anything, marriage is a complete trust that the other person will be faithful (for better or worse) we live in the tensions of trusting people everyday (even strangers we do not know who drive vehicles). Let us have both a precision of mind and openness of heart in dialoging on these matters. By Edward Wagenknecht, There is also the Alan Watts definition of the difference between having beliefs and having faith. And this is the connection to mysticism. It seems like deep human contact or contact with God can exist only within the framework of these projects, based on the protocols of the overarching system. On another point, both in Johns writings and Peters writings there are statements of eye-witness testimonies. The list of aspects offered doesnt quite get us to a means by which to assess exclusivity. 610-341-5800. So I would never presume to tell someone like Pete or the Dali Lama that their experiences are not in their subjective sense real. Only that any confidence they glean from those experiences to then conclude what they believe they encountered they actually in fact have, well, that I would claim is highly suspect and demonstrably so. Intelligence, understanding and attainment cannot attain the depth of knowledge to study or scrutinise the Godhead. As is knowledge of Allah. That is what He did for me over 50 years ago. Left the Ministry. He was after all, our first RC President. enns has published three books hijacking the agenda: economic power and political influence (winner of the gladys m. kammerer award, presented by the american political science association to honor the best book published during the previous year in the field of u.s. national policy), incarceration nation: how the united states became the most And if your eye causes you to stumble, pluck it out. Biblical scholar and author Dr. Peter Enns will be in Lynchburg for a series of "Evolution Weekend" events February 15-16, joining with many other such efforts nationwide under the umbrella of the Clergy Letter Project.. So lets give that a shot. That said, I can see the contemplative Hindu or Buddhist saying the exact same thing. I only presume that peoples experiences of God are a mixed bag that lay along a very wide spectrum. to the barricades of heaven where Im from. Peter Enns, Ph.D. Peter Enns Abram S. Clemens Professor of Biblical Studies 610-341-1491 McInnis 200B penns@eastern.edu Dr. Enns is a biblical scholar who teaches and writes on Old Testament, New Testament, Second Temple Judaism, and the intersection of biblical studies and contemporary Christian faith. I want to be like you. Were two thousand years in. I think the proper locus of religious conviction can help one find meaning in a religion better than help one find a religion. There are multiple (a lot!) It is vitally important that we respond with a yes when He calls, and this is why humility is sooo important. Historically, I understand the Mystics predate the Enlightenment or Modernity, but I think it was Friedrich Schleiermacher who cut a swath through the rough underbrush of Empiricism to find a spiritual path that was immediate and subjective. Such as I would imagine the Eastern Orthodox who are known for such practice and perspective on faith. Its generally NOT considered trustworthy; if it was then Bigfoot and alien abductions would be accepted beyond the fringe as accurate descriptions of reality/history. According to Enns, when Paul spoke about Adam, he was not communicating actual history (though Paul believed that he was), rather, he was highlighting an important theological fact (the universal sinfulness of man), employing the most foundational biblical idiom available to him (Enns 2012, p. 142). I realize that there is a long and rich history of discussion over difficult philosophical issues concerning the existence of God. Which then opens up the question of what reality it what knowing we are engaged in. And now my 800 words are up. Peter Eric Enns (born January 2, 1961) is an American Biblical scholar and theologian. where Paul regards Adam's disobedience as the cause of universal sin and death from which humanity is redeemed through the obedience of Christ. On the contrary, I have never been disappointed by God. He was dismissed as O.T. Every disciple of the kingdom of heaven is like a householder who draws out from their storage room things both old and new. http://infidels.org/library/modern/ed_babinski/experience.html, Speaking of the vibrant Christian life, Leaving the Ministry. Adam and Eve are the Bible's first man and first woman. Evidence used that way is a foundationalist dead end, but thats not the only way of interpreting Experience, of which scientific experiments are one kind. Instead, he needs to go the edge of the realm and scratch against the edges. as yours. Now, whether this evidence is good evidence or not. Peter Enns' latest book is written in praise of question marks, especially those that crowd our minds when God goes missing. We know by comparing our own, internal, subjective experiences of sight that this is a largely reliable sense. Interesting Beau, thanks. He speaks actively in academic and ecclesiastical venues on topics pertaining the Bible and Christian faith. You can hold your views and that is simply fine (I respect them) but just because you cannot see the reasons for people maintaining a doubting christian faith does not mean you are right and everyone else should take a step further and doubt the whole thing That is an over simplification of the complexity of the christian faith. As long as the genes replicate, its worked. 2. I am not sure that is the name. Instead of humbly stating this belief as an opinion, Joker3857 blatantly says "then dont be one". I get your post. These failures in relationships (failure to relate, especially failure to love) are far more damaging than our many failures to understand, our sessions of doubt or even our failures to understand how we know. I would like you to rethink your own perspective a bit more, perhaps move a bit more toward universalism and religious pluralism like John Hick, but even that would not be nearly as far away from your present point of view as the distance you have already come from fundamentalism to your present point of view. As is our collaborative aspects of the scientific method. In view of all that is eternal it would not be worth much to consider them other than to satisfy academic curiosity. And so we have the prophetic word confirmed, which you do well to heed as a light that shines in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts; knowing this first, that no prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation, for prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit If we raise it all today (or tomorrow or Wednesday tbh) we're going to make. And it is that faith that is pleasing to God, and further that faith is a gift from God in the first place. Thats not to say that understanding the world as-is doesnt matter; it does. Peter is 61 years old. We dont have the tools to give up what makes sense to us without putting up ideological fences and safety nets around everything. And if Peter didnt write it and the author was not present; is it still considered an eyewitness testimony? With the exact same merit. I find cultural differences to be fascinating and rich sources in discovering what is possible within the human experience. (Isnt this another example of a way of knowing?). If the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ does exist, watch out. It is knowing of a different order. He is the Robert S. Harrison Director of the Cornell Center for Social Sciences and Executive Director of the Roper Center for Public Opinion Research. R'eyes via Compfight Peter Enns is the master at creating blog titles that are both clever and provocative. As a United Methodist, part of how I articulate this is in the language of experience (1 part of what Albert Outler named the Wesleyan quadrilateral). It isnt about intellectual knowing and many people butcher Christianity when they think it is Im afraid. Scientists tend to understand everything through the lens of our basic five senses which reside in our body and soul. There is no external mention of the writing until Origen in the 3rd century. Peter Enns $ 9.89 - $ 15.31 The Sin of Certainty: Why God Desires Our Trust More Than Our "Correct" Beliefs Peter Enns $ 16.04 Inspiration and Incarnation: Evangelicals and the Problem of the Old Testament Peter Enns $ 5.09 - $ 20.21 Telling God's Story: A Parents' Guide to Teaching the Bible Peter Enns $ 8.89 - $ 11.40 Asking whether the enemy, or lunch, or nothing is moving in the bush over there is something we do together. As claimed, the Incarnation passed through our material and human existence. longing While the truth of non-material claims can not be measured, the effects of the beliefs in them can be considered and studied. Just trust in Him. Havent found much written on it. Now as to whether what the historical eyewitness claims he experienced is a real supernatural phenomenon well that is where faith comes in. I have met lifelong atheists who never got high on Jesus in their youth like you or I did. That your mind cannot stretch to embrace a perspective that seems to transcend all of existence. But the Bible is not an instruction manual or rule book but a powerful learning tool that nurtures our spiritual growth, argues Bible scholar Peter Enns. Legitttttttt. I would encourage you to ask God to show you His truth from His book. Peter Enns Quotes. I think there is a model there where the subjective, but real experience of God is the starting point for understanding the perceptual equipment, which will help us to acknowledge the existence of a real Being that makes the subjective states or experiences real. But in essence our Christian hope is a trust that God will in fact be good to his word (which is trust now verifying the identity of God through science observation seems impossible but there are many things, and I say many things we cannot fully grasp by using human studies, judgments, experimentation, etc). Without discounting all those wonderful things, I do not think that the God question is settled this way. How sure are you that those are eyewitness accounts. He affirms that Israel's laws were not new in content but were uniquely in that they were connected to a monotheistic community-Israel (57). Great Value. 254). We engage in an endless constellation of projects, such as ministry projects, evangelistic missions, sermon series, small groups etc. Thanks for posting this. Again, while it takes a God-given faith to believe the substance of Peter and Johns testimonies, are we to take from your article that we should not put trust in the authenticity of their writings? This is the third post in a series on how God speaks to us in Scripture, following a discussion on what the early church fathers believed about how that process happened and Kenton Sparks' adoptionist proposal of a sacred "broken" Bible.. There are surely myriad of ways of knowing God In the provIsIons that are avaIlable to each one of us, As one is riding the Starlight Express propelled through time experiencing mAturity, old Age And deAth. You presume too much Ed. All of life is a response. I have written on Peter Enns before on our blog (see the link in the analysis to Evans' book) but seeing his name again led me to look up Enns and I found he wrote a recent piece on his blog titled "How Can I Trust the Bible . Origen and universalism, in general, were condemned as unorthodox at the Fifth Ecumenical Council of Constantinople (A.D. 553) . Peter Enns is the last person that I will analyze simply because he probably best typifies what can happen once one begins the downward spiral on adopting an evolutionary view to Scripture. It certainly seems that way as we compare the experiences of people across faiths. better bring your own redemption when you come IMHO knowing God is as relevant as your next breath, I mean, who gave you that breath? As claimed, the Incarnation passed through our material and human existence. Christianity is already becoming irrelevant to the younger millennials. Yet since these experiences come across as transcendent many put a higher truth value on them than anything else in life. Open your eyes to what there is to see, or let Jesus open them for you (Mark 8, by daubing mud) and I theres not that much problem. Some people really hate what I say--and I've lost a couple of jobs because of my views. Universalism is the belief that everyone eventually will be saved. Or read my own my testimony where I mention the effect that finding and fully acknowledging goodness in people of all beliefs or none had on me. . Read Dr. Enns onThe Bible for Normal People Given all this and more, my personal choice is simply to continue to acknowledge Gods blessings upon my life and therefore acknowledge God. This is a dangerous and unbiblical attitude. I know others mileage may vary. This emphasis on experience is important at a simple, direct level (participating in corporate worship, daily prayer, seeing/hearing God in others, etc. Incarceration Nation The good news is that those who humble themselves and say yes when He calls do experience Him in an undeniable complete way. In both stories, the boat comes to rest on a mountain and birds are sent out to find land. I agree that post-enlightenment empiricism is never going to lead to genuine interaction with the creator, but what about prayer? To dig down a little deeper theologically, I can deeply understand the paradox of the Incarnation of not only a God-as-man, but in the form of a baby in a manager in Galilee in first-century Palestine. Thank you Joseph. Read Nondiscrimination Policy. Israelite history; Old Testament and ancient Near East; Old Testament theology; biblical theology; wisdom literature; Second Temple Judaism and the New Testament. depth Fideism is a rich and credible approach to knowing God. I think the Mystics have something important to say. (edited with Chris Wlezien). While some would say the orthodox Nature of God and his Oneness pertains to Being, I think most more linearly worship something that is more a manner of /a/ being than Being. One task that gives me great joy is to introduce students to the big picture of the biblical story and to develop insight and respect for how the Old and New Testaments are in conversation with each other. It was first proposed by the unorthodox church Father, Origen (ca. Peter K. Enns Professor, Department of Government and Brooks School of Public Policy and Robert S. Harrison Director of the Cornell Center for Social Sciences Summary Peter K. Enns is a Professor in the Department of Government and the Brooks School of Public Policy and Robert S. Harrison Director of the Cornell Center for Social Sciences. And the one thing that every single wisdom tradition or religious group teaches is the way. Pete is a well-known bible scholar and is the Abram S. Clemens professor of Bible Studies at Eastern University in Pennsylvania. One of the things Ive yet to see in Dr Enns and other Evangelicals take up of evolution is a robust address of its implications to thinking. It is no more Western and modern than the Greek-named constellations are ancient and Greek or the Arabic-named stars are Medieval and Arab. . Dr. Peter Enns (PhD, Harvard University) is Abram S. Clemens professor of Biblical Studies at Eastern University, St. Davids, PA. Or the mega church movement, to try and get and sustain even a greater Jesus high. There is an even less certain, less dogmatic, less religious, kind of trust. But may I pose this: . But does anyone really need to write a book to make explicit what every religious person implicitly practices in terms of maintaining their beliefs and holy practices? Were two thousand years in. A Review by Norman Geisler of Peter Enns's, Inspiration and Incarnation: Evangelicals and the Problem of the Old Testament (Grand Rapids . Not sure what the phrase, proper locus of religious conviction means, because based on my own interactions with a wide variety of folks I have noticed that people dont have the same attraction to mystical or spiritual thinking. Certainly, too many Islamists (by no means all) are tragically attempting to force their beliefs on others, and the result is ISIS, AQ, Boko Haram, and too many other groups. . Or become a universalist mystic, or a philosophical theist rather than a religious one, and continue to question just what kind of God really exists, and what we can know for sure about who or what God is? in being with another person expressing love in ones flesh. transrational http://www.al-islam.org/tradition-myrobalan-fruit-hadith-al-halila-imam-jafar-al-sadiq/hadith. Faced with the incoherence of a fundamentalist/evangelical reaction to modernity, I have no problem accepting Pascals Wager and embracing your mystical/existential explanation. Differing, I believe there are grounds for excluding ones own or other faiths. Evidence based knowledge may not be necessary for a person to believe in God, but it sure would be handy when it comes to rival claims about God between people in different religions, denominations and mystical sects, not to mention between various schools of non-religious philosophical theists, agnostics and atheists. There are great books written by the likes of Brennan Manning on trusting God and there are great books written on eschatology (Jurgen Moltmann, N. T. Wright, etc) about Gods salvation extending from the ends of the earth. Some come by more rational means, others emotional, others mystical, Who am I, or you, to say any one way is the right way. God means many different things to people. So its great that God is guiding you and keeping you safe but yet not doing the same for kids with cancer etc. Usually we treat eye-witness testimonies as valid proofs of an experience, especially when they corroborate key elements of the same story (granted one can misinterpret what their senses tell them). I also suspect that you and Frank probably share many criticisms of your more conservative Christian pasts. By Peter K. Enns I have published three books: Hijacking the Agenda (with Chris Witko, Nate Kelly and Jana Morgan), Incarceration Nation, and Who Gets Represented? read the whole Chicago Statement aloud to his cat, Marmalade. Enns prefers this approach because it supports his view of Adam as proto-Israel (107) and maintains an Israel-centered focus rather than a universal one (106). .without faith one cannot please God His words, not mine. Let God alone if need be. And there seems to be a bit of a one-way mirror phenomenon going on. that Christians suffer like everyone else. Instead only their book features inspired writingsthe truth and stories necessary to believe, and of course conservatives, moderates and liberals differ concerning what that book really means or what the most essential and necessary lessons are. When I gave up the notion of God, I did not give up on the experiences of participation, longing, fullness, contemplativeness, depth, and immediacy. I suggest you read Richard Rohr. And even ones blindness to this And lAck of understanding the necessity of grAtitude for thAt Is not a barricade to the reality of the creator of ones flesh & spirit. ), and you certainly dont hear much about divorce, suicide Forced love . You never know, He might answer you in a marvelous and loving way. Youve concisely and clearly explained the way I understand my faith and conviction in the existence of God. In fact, presuming that evidence-based knowledge is the only sure way of knowing anythingworth knowing lies behind both the angst and the sense of certainty many feel about Gods existence or non-existence. Instead it looks like people have a wide variety of reality tunnels and interpretations. Even today Christians keep founding relatively new and youthful institutions devoted to walling themselves up against questions, like Liberty Christian U, or Tim LaHays Heritage Christian U, or Patrick Henry U, or all the televangelist stations on TV. Magic is not real therefore magical deities are impossible. As I see it, knowledge ofGod accesses different ways of knowing. Deities that the Christian faith does not hold to exist. Enns believes that there are many different views of God and that we human beings cannot tell which is the correct ones, and that it is better that we do not know for certain than that we do know for certain. Also check out The Inner Eye of Love by a Jesuit named William Johnson, or try books by Dom Bede Griffiths, a fellow convert with C. S. Lewis but who spent his life in India dialoguing with people of other religions. Just dont mistakethis as an argument for Gods existence. Its just where my thinking process is. These are subjective, private experiences. I think it is safe to say that much of my academic journey has been a process of synthesizing these (and other) influences in my life. But let us then continue this comparison to Buddhism. For, everything is under the one and the same law-the law of transformation and decline. Graciousness to Americans and more? In asking does God exist?, Ive heard it said that two very large questions are revealed or not. 1. These are ideals that I subjectively value. Sorry for the aimless rambling and thanks again for your post! And I would suggest this hypothetical is realized in all actuality within spiritual perception. You just need to go a little further, Peter. I mean, I continue to wonder about such questions after leaving Evangelicalism. I find cultural differences to be fascinating and rich sources in discovering what is possible within the human experience. The Evolution of Adam: What the Bible does and doesn't say about human origins Jonathan Jong 2012, Theology and Science Abstract In this review, I summarize and critically evaluate Peter Enns's claim that evangelicals ought not read Genesis 13 literally. Id be interested to know then what your thoughts are with the more broad, inclusive sense of evidence then. Alot of us have reached the point where the only left left to do is bring people together despite our differences. Professor; Executive Director, Roper Center for Public Opinion Research; Robert S. Harrison Director, Cornell Center for Social Sciences. (Yawn.) One of the hallmarks of progressive Christianity is a rejection of biblical sexuality, and an affirmation of same-sex marriage and premarital sex. As if chosen by God to tell people who should be a christian based on their concerns regarding the bible. Its not that we dont know, its that our knowing is ultimately so relative. I think there are many different kinds of trust in God, not just the Christian God of the Bible. 298 . Hey Ed; I can definitely understand what youre saying and thats why many people go thru many religions while on this path of truth. He has taught extensively at the seminary and doctoral levels (Westminster Theological Seminary, Princeton Theological Seminary, Harvard Divinity School, Fuller Theological Seminary, Lutheran Theological Seminary in Philadelphia, Biblical Theological Seminary) and on the undergraduate level (Temple University and Messiah College). Here's where the money is going! 3. (As ridiculous as it may sound in our context) I was on a run and received a word of prophecy to deliver to an old friend. Are you willing to also consider; Hindu scriptures, Muslim scriptures, Buddhist, scriptures, Taoists scriptures, etc? Dr. Enns seems to take the view that the status of the archeological evidence is BOTH universal and static. I do not think the gospel stands on whether we can read Paul's Adam in the . Matthew 13:52. To conclude, I'd like to quote Enns one more time. If we hold to the same manner in which we share any other experience with those around us, we would ge bound to accept this. Acts of Interpretation features essays by biblical scholars and theologians offering broad reflections on key interpretive issues, rich readings of challenging biblical texts, and interaction with the Christian exegetical tradition from Melito of Sardis to Dietrich Bonhoeffer.The contributors to this volume are leading figures in the theological interpretation of Scripture. Perhaps agreat offense to many of us in the modern world is thatGod is not known in the way we are used to knowing many other thingswhich is a hard pill to swallow if youre committed to evidence-based knowing as the only path forward. Try the works of John Hick, former Evangelical who became a fascinating philosopher of religion and sought a common transcendental basis for them all. I would never ever suggest this is a unique property of Xty. By some measure, through Jesus of Nazareth and the ensuing religion of Christianity, a longing has been fulfilled; there has been great participation. In fact, there are now around two billion adherents to the faith. Perhaps its ones urge for drinking mothers milk when one is first born (who gave you a mother? straight into the night our hearts were flung Read Dr. Enns onAcademia.edu I say, God. Hi, Reddit! As is knowledge of Lord Brahma, Lord Vishnu, and Lord Shiva. The Quran Chapter 112, Things are compound elements atoms etc, made of parts. His research and teaching focus on public opinion and political representation, mass incarceration and the legal system, and data science. And it is worth noting that my list is subjective too. Although, both people and God can be disappointing in ways myself included. But when you reach the point where there is little to differentiate between different encounters or transcendent perceptions yielding incompatible truth claims, then you are not just dealing with a measure of uncertainty to be tolerated, but rather a total lack of confidence in whether what you believe corresponds to actual reality. http://edward-t-babinski.blogspot.com/2015/03/on-recovering-from-alcoholism-drug.html, See also my paper the critiques the claim that the Christian experience is unique ". Id suggest that this is even true among the authors of Scripture and with general trends by the centuries as well as across Fowlers stages of faith as well as by denomination and religion. apprehension uncluttered by thought Scrivenings Christians depression, suicide. 1 Say: He is Allah, the One and Only; For those who hold the view that the Bible contains an ever-expanding revelation of the truth and knowledge of God from beginning to end, what is to be taken away from your article? We would then be wise to doubt the veracity of our own sight. The gathered Body of Christ? Maybe dramatically more so? http://edward-t-babinski.blogspot.com/2015/08/christians-or-non-christians-who-suffer.html But, that we ourselves interact, relate, care, love is even more important. Theists believe magic is real. Find it on Amazon: http://amzn.to/19X9WC7Find it at CBD: http://bit.ly/1dnBcesPeter Enns discusses the inerrancy of the Bible as an often contentious topic. prof at Westminster Seminary for his progressive evangelicalism, and has not identified himself as a universalist. THIS IS CANCELLED: His main public presentation will be Saturday, February 15, at 8 p.m. in Sydnor Performance Hall, Schewel Hall, University of Lynchburg, drawing from . Try an approach that says were really not sure but most likely in my opinion this is the one I think it is. There is none for 11 Peter, a writing a majority of critical scholarship places at some point in the 2nd century long after Peters death (Wikipedias page on it is a decent starting point showing the various arguments). But it takes the work of the Spirit of God in ones life to actually believe and rely upon these evidences. Instead, it should be understood as participation in the mystery of the transformational journey toward union with God in love. 75-76]. In Inspiration and Incarnation, Peter Enns proposes an incarnational model for understanding how the Bible was inspired by God. God or not God? Perhaps the thing that could hold rationality, mysticism, intuition, etc all together is love- as a way of knowing. . This answer is Biblical, albeit unpopular: the bible has always presupposed an (at least) 2 tiered, interlocking cosmology: the visible and invisible. It goes without saying that the writings you mentioned can contain interesting concepts, but they do not reveal the God of the universe anymore than an Agatha Christy mystery, which I dearly enjoy. The intersection of these (with a lot of other stuff thrown in there for good measure, such as Barths furious response to 19th century liberals on issues related to mediated/unmediated experience) was very compelling in my theological studies and has been fascinating to observe on a practical level in pastoral ministry in the conservative south, especially in this political and cultural moment. He has not permitted human mind to grasp the Essence of His Being **YET** He has not prevented them from realising His Presence. ), In chapter 5 Learning from the Christian Mystics Benner discusses a knowledge of God that is transrational and contemplative.. But as for the title, in the publishing world, titles are meant to be succinct and attract attention (which obviously worked).The book explains what I mean. And I learned about the history of all these relatively young fundamentalist Christian colleges founded in the 1920s like WTS, during the fndamentalist-modernist controversy. fullness It is based on direct and personal encounter. There are multitudes of examples of God giving evidence to his people so they might believe, or trust him. If so, they can be dismissed with their faulty foundations, but offered opportunity to reconsider their understandings and emphases to get back in the race. The more I learn about the cosmos and humanitys journey of understanding it, the more the term evidence seems to be an oxymoron. God that is transrational and contemplative life, Leaving the Ministry //infidels.org/library/modern/ed_babinski/experience.html, Speaking of the realm and scratch the... 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Based on direct and personal encounter pete enns universalism S. Harrison Director, Roper for... But let us have reached the point where the only left left to do is bring people together despite differences! Same thing Ecumenical Council of Constantinople ( A.D. 553 ) scratch against the edges the edge of the until. Embrace a perspective that seems to take the view that the God Father. In asking does God exist?, Ive heard it said that two very questions... To satisfy academic curiosity hold rationality, mysticism, intuition, etc Joker3857 says... Out from their storage room things both old and new, subjective of. Of trust, were condemned as unorthodox at the Fifth Ecumenical Council of Constantinople ( A.D. 553.! Your mystical/existential explanation not please God his words, not mine like Pete or the stars! Say, God, love is even more important its worked by the unorthodox church Father Origen... Certainly seems that way as we compare the experiences of God that is eternal would... Whether this evidence is both universal and static conclude, I do not think that the Christian Mystics Benner a... Etc all together is love- as a way of knowing then opens up the question of what it. Uncluttered by thought Scrivenings Christians depression, suicide Forced love which reside in our body soul... And further that faith that is eternal it would not be worth much to consider them than. Dali Lama that their experiences are not in their subjective sense real comparison to Buddhism the have. For Public opinion and political representation, mass incarceration and the legal system, and Lord Shiva series small.
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